New development in Frisco - Wade Park

bizguy

Diamond Member
#61
You do realize the City's hands have been tied on this...right? This isn't a CITY issue, it's a federal issue I believe (either EPA or Corp of Engineers..can't remember which). But it's easier to &*X*&S about the city then actually learn why there are hold-ups.

Many times, ROW and easement issues arise with landowners. Unlike Dallas, Frisco doesn't strong-arm, threaten or sic the FBI on landowners into order to take their land for roads. Maybe a bit of bribery and arm-tugging...(j/k), but nothing like Dallas and other cities have pulled.
Yeah, Dallas is bad about that... over a couple of years a friend of mine had a portion of his commercial property condemned to expand a road (below market reimbursement), then an assessment levied for road improvement and finally an increase in property tax due to higher valuation due to the new road..... needless to say, he was not happy about that at all....
 

Piiilot

Platinum Member
#62
So here is my simple minded question. Isn't the Cowboys complex supposed to be built within a mixed use development that includes the same components of Wade Crossing ? And, I go back to Frisco Square. It is struggling at best. If the EDC continues to fund projects that will draw development away from Frisco Square aren't we cutting our own nose off - or are we throwing the towel in on Frisco Square and will just fund it through the special taxing authority for that special taxing district ?
 

Rebel

Diamond Member
#63
So here is my simple minded question. Isn't the Cowboys complex supposed to be built within a mixed use development that includes the same components of Wade Crossing ? And, I go back to Frisco Square. It is struggling at best. If the EDC continues to fund projects that will draw development away from Frisco Square aren't we cutting our own nose off - or are we throwing the towel in on Frisco Square and will just fund it through the special taxing authority for that special taxing district ?
There are projects in the works for Frisco Square as well (not just gearbox either).
 

Piiilot

Platinum Member
#64
There are projects in the works for Frisco Square as well (not just gearbox either).
I understand there are projects in the works, what I am concerned about is what the city is doing to sustain those projects. Lots of "used to be" space down there. Which is sad because I spend a LOT of time down there.
 

Mom+4

Silver Member
#65
So here is my simple minded question. Isn't the Cowboys complex supposed to be built within a mixed use development that includes the same components of Wade Crossing ? And, I go back to Frisco Square. It is struggling at best. If the EDC continues to fund projects that will draw development away from Frisco Square aren't we cutting our own nose off - or are we throwing the towel in on Frisco Square and will just fund it through the special taxing authority for that special taxing district ?
While you make a good point about the Cowboys Complex and Wade Crossing having some overlap...I don't think Frisco Square will EVER be on the same level as these other types of retail developments. I'm hoping to see Frisco Square develop out more (Gearbox will help), but it will take more time without a powerhouse developer behind it. IIRC didn't TWO developers involved with FS go bankrupt? I think trying to compare FS to Shops of Legacy or these new developments is a mistake. Reality is we need to realize FS will never be what it was originally intended and develop it to be unique and different.

We're getting the new outdoor mall at 380 and the Tollway, now 2 new large mixed-used developments. I'd like to see FS develop into something more similar to downtown Grapevine. Funky, unique stores...not just chain retail (a la Southlake...and these new developments). Most people don't realize that a great many downtown Grapevine buildings were torn down and rebuilt but they had to be built to "look old" as to stay within he aesthetic. It's worked well for them. I'd love to see FS connect with an improved downtown, with a trolly or trolly/bus connecting the two. I'd vote for razing some of the 60's style building and rebuilding to look more like the one's with the false fronts. Our downtown has so much more possibility!
 

bizguy

Diamond Member
#66
So here is my simple minded question. Isn't the Cowboys complex supposed to be built within a mixed use development that includes the same components of Wade Crossing ? And, I go back to Frisco Square. It is struggling at best. If the EDC continues to fund projects that will draw development away from Frisco Square aren't we cutting our own nose off - or are we throwing the towel in on Frisco Square and will just fund it through the special taxing authority for that special taxing district ?
I don't think they are similar as represented so far:

Cowboys - practice facility, several office buildings, high end hotels, and restaurants

Wade - mainly retail and apartments with some office space

or that's as near as I can figure from what has been disclosed so far....
 
#67
I don't think they are similar as represented so far:

Cowboys - practice facility, several office buildings, high end hotels, and restaurants

Wade - mainly retail and apartments with some office space

or that's as near as I can figure from what has been disclosed so far....
I see SERIOUS overlap - very similar centers - both will have hotel, retail and restaurants - and office buildings - and apartments.

Though it appears Frisco Station will have a bit heavier TOURIST/VISITOR draw by having the Cowboys complex - and there are rumors of tourist friendly restaurant/entertainment venues such as Jimmy Buffett Margaritaville. Based on location - being near so many sports venues and being next to Hall Park (Hall gets a ton of business travelers) - I'd expect more hotels at Frisco Station than at Wade Park.

Wade Park - rumored to be anchored by Whole Foods - will probably have more of a RESIDENT draw.

Hopefully we can absorb both simultaneously while maintaining some growth at Frisco Square. At least Hall Park is almost fully built out now - so Duke, Wade Park and Frisco Station should get the lion's share of new office tenants (with some current competition from Granite Park in Plano - and in the future from the new Frisco North mixed use shopping center.)
 

pearceg

Diamond Member
#68
Though it appears Frisco Station will have a bit heavier TOURIST/VISITOR draw by having the Cowboys complex ...
This keeps getting repeated as fact, but is this year-round crowd of slackjawed gawkers really going to materialize outside of a marketing consultant's fantasy publication? Is there a substantial amount of Valley Ranch tourism generated by the Cowboys HQ?

I did a web search for "valley ranch cowboys tours" and the only relevant link that came up was this one which advertises a "private tour of the Valley Ranch Headquarters and Practice Facility" to their "limited amount of Founders Club, Club VIP, Club Blue and Club Silver package travelers" and only if you book Cowboys travel packages through "the official fan travel partner of the Dallas Cowboys."

I can't even find a mention of a gift shop at Valley Ranch, and you know if Jerry thought that was a way he could separate more rubes from more of their money, he'd be all-in on that action.

Except for the one week of training camp they are required to hold in Frisco, the closest the average fan on the street is going to get to Valley Ranch North is driving by and pointing at the signage.
 

Mom+4

Silver Member
#69
I see SERIOUS overlap - very similar centers - both will have hotel, retail and restaurants - and office buildings - and apartments.

Though it appears Frisco Station will have a bit heavier TOURIST/VISITOR draw by having the Cowboys complex - and there are rumors of tourist friendly restaurant/entertainment venues such as Jimmy Buffett Margaritaville. Based on location - being near so many sports venues and being next to Hall Park (Hall gets a ton of business travelers) - I'd expect more hotels at Frisco Station than at Wade Park.

Wade Park - rumored to be anchored by Whole Foods - will probably have more of a RESIDENT draw.

Hopefully we can absorb both simultaneously while maintaining some growth at Frisco Square. At least Hall Park is almost fully built out now - so Duke, Wade Park and Frisco Station should get the lion's share of new office tenants (with some current competition from Granite Park in Plano - and in the future from the new Frisco North mixed use shopping center.)

I know it's too much to hope for, but it would be wonderful if all the new office space drove down rates just a bit. By the end of 2014 I plan to outgrow my current office space and prices in Frisco are hard to digest!
 

Rebel

Diamond Member
#70
I know it's too much to hope for, but it would be wonderful if all the new office space drove down rates just a bit. By the end of 2014 I plan to outgrow my current office space and prices in Frisco are hard to digest!
End of 2014? Depends on how fast Hall Office Park, and those new buildings south of 121 fill up. Those are the ones that will impact 2014. Anything not already going up won't be done in 2014 and won't help you.
 

KH3

Senior Member
#73
There was/is a slight delay on movement of a utility for the Stonebrook Pkwy Improvements. Aside from that, its on schedule. It might feel like it takes forever but when you're installing a 36 inch water line in addition to adding a lane, and keeping all intersections open for traffic movement, on a street that is essentially fully built out on both sides, its never an easy process.
I do understand construction can take a bit, but they said it was supposed to be open BEFORE school started. When did school start again?? I haven't even seen anyone working on it for weeks. I drive it 4x daily. It's such a pain. My daughter goes to St Philips, so I don't have a choice.
 
#75
One of my FI clients owns the SW corner lot of Warren & Dallas Pkwy.
You can expect to see movement at that location in the distant near future.

End of year or early next year.
With everything going on in that area - that lot is worth a small fortune.

Btw, I tried to talk the Fish Express owners from closing two years ago. I said with all the rumors going on at that intersection (pre-Cowboys deal, pre-Frisco Station) that they shoud stay - they'll have plenty of business within a few years at that intersection. (Now Dickey's is in their old spot - and they're doing well even though they sell crappy BBQ. Wait until The Cowboys arrive.)