FISD hiking tax rate

This is all a reaction to the $30M hit in state funding. There are only so many ways to make up $30M per year. If the district was capable of trimming $30M from its budget, they would have done so years ago.

If the question is how efficiently the district manages its finances, we can review audits and compare spending across district with similar circumstances. This issue is a revenue issue more than a cost issue.

The real question is why the state is attempting to transfer education funding from energy, corporate, and sales tax onto property tax rolls. When the lottery was being campaigned through the legislature, the plan was to use the proceeds to fund education. Where is that money today? No one has put the spotlight on the legislatures strategy over the past years in spite of the turmoil it has caused across the state.
 

Mom+4

Silver Member
^^^ yep, if you get caught printing something at school for personal use you will be in big trouble. Just one example.
When the recession hit, budget belts tightened to noose-like conditions. They haven't really let them loose since then.

The district DID find creative ways to save money. Simply adjusting the start/end times a few minutes they were able to double the use of the bus fleet and personnel. Of course, people complained that "they should have thought of that BEFORE". Of course, hindsight was 20/20. Every new cost cutting measure and improvement is met with "that's not enough" or "well, why haven't you ALWAYS been doing it that way."
 
Personally, i am looking forward to Mr. Noskin negotiating the next 'School' contract with his 'construction experience'.. Hope he follows procurement laws in Texas..
 

TPW

Diamond Member
Personally, i am looking forward to Mr. Noskin negotiating the next 'School' contract with his 'construction experience'.. Hope he follows procurement laws in Texas..
I think Mr. Noskin is in way over his head and I'm laying the marker down now that he is going to be giant failure as a board member.
 

bizguy

Diamond Member
I think Mr. Noskin is in way over his head and I'm laying the marker down now that he is going to be giant failure as a board member.
My main problem with him as that he seemed to have the answer before knowing what the problems were. Don't get me wrong, I don't think any of the candidates were totally dialed in on the funding issues, but at least Anjali and Phil were willing to listen and learn instead of just saying "no new taxes"....
 

bizguy

Diamond Member
When the recession hit, budget belts tightened to noose-like conditions. They haven't really let them loose since then.

The district DID find creative ways to save money. Simply adjusting the start/end times a few minutes they were able to double the use of the bus fleet and personnel. Of course, people complained that "they should have thought of that BEFORE". Of course, hindsight was 20/20. Every new cost cutting measure and improvement is met with "that's not enough" or "well, why haven't you ALWAYS been doing it that way."
that is my impression as well. I was one of those folks who complained that they hadn't been great watchdogs prior to the recession. I believe a highlight of Reedy's legacy is that he changed that culture over his last 5 years as superintendent.

In any case, we all knew this day was going to get here. Nobody can think that Frisco had some sort of magic fairy dust that keeps educating kids here 10% lower than any other city around.
 

Mom+4

Silver Member
that is my impression as well. I was one of those folks who complained that they hadn't been great watchdogs prior to the recession. I believe a highlight of Reedy's legacy is that he changed that culture over his last 5 years as superintendent.

In any case, we all knew this day was going to get here. Nobody can think that Frisco had some sort of magic fairy dust that keeps educating kids here 10% lower than any other city around.
True .. and quite honestly that is the nature of the beast of fast growth.

We went from a tiny district to big #'s almost overnight (or really really really fast). People in leadership simply were not equipped with the knowledge to handle such fast growth while keeping a tight reign on the checkbook. They didn't know what they didn't know.

Many companies, in times of super fast growth, tend to pay more to fix a problem RIGHT NOW rather than find a less expensive solution. Those solutions are often found by bringing in new people with different perspectives and experiences.

Same thing happened to FISD before the recession. HUGE growth, very fast....the admin leaders simply didn't have the knowledge to manage that sort of growth cost effectively.

And then you get new people and the old guard fears for their jobs...and things get worse before they get better. FISD is not immune to such internal politics. With such ingrained "we've always done it this way" and the deep nepotism that exists(ed) in FISD (my mother/brother/sister/aunt/uncle is XX, you can't make me do anything) - change can be slow and painful.

My relative that works in FISD has been so frustrated over the years. Proposals for change that were thrown in the trash can, mocked or ignored...that would save $$$$. Well, that would mean change, that would mean someone other than the boss has a better idea or it might mean someone would have to do more than a half days work (stretched to a full day). She has seen a TON of change over the last two years. But a few years ago....oh my the stories she told me! Sounds a lot like some companies I've worked for a decade or so ago!
 

ssbssc

Senior Member
Yea, and a lot of people are much more fortunate. What's your point?

Avg 1% raise a yr over the course of 10 yrs isn't much to talk about. It's an extremely high growth district. They aren't gonna be letting teachers go. Definitely not my wife cause she's one of the best and she doesn't do it for the money.
Couple that 1% raise with a significant jump in insurance premiums and your at a loss over all.
 

ssbssc

Senior Member
Lyon and the rest of the bookkeeping staff went to every fisd building with employees and talked to all the staff about this tax vote. What they told the staff members but are forgetting to say is that the tax increase is a temporary fix for about 3-5 years max. Those words came out of lyon's mouth and were reiterated by the CFO. Its a permanent tax that is a temporary fix for 3-5 years.......They will be back asking for more in that time frame.

The 30mil that they paid to the cowboys came from some tax fund that was set up between they and the city when the mall was built. TIF maybe? It is tax dollars from the mall area.

He said the 30mil the district will be short wasnt because of that. He said it was because of the state cutting funding that they knew was happening incrementally and would end soon.

They told the staff there would be a 2% raise and about $65 (actually $45 according to latest info) towards ins to help reduce any increase in premiums. The icing was the one time 2% stipend paid to every employee Jan 2017. Which they said would cover the tax increase should the vote pass.
 
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Mom+4

Silver Member
Lyon and the rest of the bookkeeping staff went to every fisd building with employees and talked to all the staff about this tax vote. What they told the staff members but are forgetting to say is that the tax increase is a temporary fix for about 3-5 years max. Those words came out of lyon's mouth and were reiterated by the CFO. Its a permanent tax that is a temporary fix for 3-5 years.......They will be back asking for more in that time frame.

The 30mil that they paid to the cowboys came from some tax fund that was set up between they and the city when the mall was built. TIF maybe? It is tax dollars from the mall area.

He said the 30mil the district will be short wasnt because of that. He said it was because of the state cutting funding that they knew was happening incrementally and would end soon.

They told the staff there would be a 2% raise and about $65 (actually $45 according to latest info) towards ins to help reduce any increase in premiums. The icing was the one time 2% stipend paid to every employee Jan 2017. Which they said would cover the tax increase should the vote pass.

It's a TIRZ - similar to the mall, but not the mall. Basically, the land is a TIRZ district. The taxes (sales tax, property tax, depending on which bond) go to pay off the bond, NOT the homeowners. I believe, FISD was the last to take advantage of this as the state has now closed the loophole allowing ISDs to fund in this manner.
 
$30 million?

Harder to control a general election vote with a few hundred bagged votes.
Is this the $30 million you are referring to, that went to the City of Frisco?

"In Frisco ISD, we have a commitment to smaller high schools which has resulted in our 10th high school opening in 2017, with at least two more needed before build out. We knew we would need a third stadium in addition to Memorial and Toyota Stadium and this was a topic of discussion and consideration prior to the 2014 bond program. But just like the opportunity to participate in Toyota Stadium, we were able to be part of a public-private partnership with the City of Frisco and, in this case, the Cowboys and the Jones family instead of FC Dallas and the Hunt family.

For our $30 million contribution, amortized over 25 years, which goes to the City of Frisco, we are able to provide students with a world-class indoor stadium that we could in no way replicate on our own. As has been seen in recent years in neighboring communities, it can take $50-60 million to build a stand-alone high school stadium. In addition, we will not incur ongoing maintenance and operations costs, resulting in a savings of $250-$300,000 annually. Participating in this partnership does not increase property or sales tax rates. Again, these funds go to the owner of the property, the City of Frisco, not the Cowboys.

The funds come from the Tax Increment Reinvestment Zone (TIRZ), established in the late 1990s. It is comprised of 713 acres in the Stonebriar Mall area. There is approximately $1.1 billion in value at this time, which yields $16 million a year in tax revenue to FISD. The tax revenue generated through the taxable value in that area goes into a special fund that allows the District to participate in public-private partnerships that benefit the growth and development in the area and also allows FISD to balance its debt service rate by reimbursing its debt payment with these funds. By law, these funds cannot be used for the maintenance and operations of the school district, such as teacher salaries."
 
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pearceg

Diamond Member
As has been seen in recent years in neighboring communities, it can take $50-60 million to build a stand-alone high school stadium.
Red herring. Hell, you can build a high school football stadium for $100 million if you want to. There is absolutely no reason FISD "needs" a stadium of this expense for the greater glory of high school football.

My high school opened last year a new football stadium too. Enrollment is 2000... right in line with FISD schools. Demolition of the old stadium and construction of the new stadium cost the school board all of around $10 million... but then it does lack such "world-class necessities" as hi-def video replay boards, luxury suites, and a dome, but it's perfectly fine for its primary mission of high school football. This isn't the NFL, no matter how many jock-sniffing administrators and parents want to pretend like it is.

In addition, we will not incur ongoing maintenance and operations costs, resulting in a savings of $250-$300,000 annually.
Another red herring. If you build a less expensive stadium with fewer gewgaws, you spend less on maintenance too. Is FISD really spending $250-300k a year on maintenance for Memorial?


Is this the $30 million you are referring to, that went to the City of Frisco? ... Again, these funds go to the owner of the property, the City of Frisco, not the Cowboys.
Regardless of whether the actual deposit is being made in an account for "City of Frisco" instead of "Jerry Jones," any attempt to spin this gift as not being for the primary benefit of the Dallas Cowboys calls into question the purported honesty of the rest of the propaganda piece.
 
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Red herring. Hell, you can build a high school football stadium for $100 million if you want to. There is absolutely no reason FISD "needs" a stadium of this expense for the greater glory of high school football.

My high school opened last year a new football stadium too. Enrollment is 2000... right in line with FISD schools. Demolition of the old stadium and construction of the new stadium cost the school board all of around $10 million... but then it does lack such "world-class necessities" as hi-def video replay boards, luxury suites, and a dome, but it's perfectly fine for its primary mission of high school football. This isn't the NFL, no matter how many jock-sniffing administrators and parents want to pretend like it is.



Another red herring. If you build a less expensive stadium with fewer gewgaws, you spend less on maintenance too. Is FISD really spending $250-300k a year on maintenance for Memorial?

Regardless of whether the actual deposit is being made in an account for "City of Frisco" instead of "Jerry Jones," any attempt to spin this gift as not being for the primary benefit of the Dallas Cowboys calls into question the purported honesty of the rest of the propaganda piece.

Love this post. just that its' wrong at every fracking turn.

1. Look at McKinney. $50M+ for a stadium.
TCO is going to be 100M plus when you account for interest and maintenance costs.
2. Memorial.
If you include the major changes that are made every 5-7 years, including new turf, compliance with new laws, AKA ADA, (pretty soon, transgender bathrooms), etc, the cost for Memorial averages about $600k a year, and will be at 750-800k in 2025+
3. The TIRZ investment was a no brainer for the district. It actually went to the City of Frisco who owns the Event Center and the HQ building. jones has a 40 year lease I believe.
4. Read the public information and not just a PAC's flier..
 
Is this the $30 million you are referring to, that went to the City of Frisco?

"In Frisco ISD, we have a commitment to smaller high schools which has resulted in our 10th high school opening in 2017, with at least two more needed before build out. We knew we would need a third stadium in addition to Memorial and Toyota Stadium and this was a topic of discussion and consideration prior to the 2014 bond program. But just like the opportunity to participate in Toyota Stadium, we were able to be part of a public-private partnership with the City of Frisco and, in this case, the Cowboys and the Jones family instead of FC Dallas and the Hunt family.

For our $30 million contribution, amortized over 25 years, which goes to the City of Frisco, we are able to provide students with a world-class indoor stadium that we could in no way replicate on our own. As has been seen in recent years in neighboring communities, it can take $50-60 million to build a stand-alone high school stadium. In addition, we will not incur ongoing maintenance and operations costs, resulting in a savings of $250-$300,000 annually. Participating in this partnership does not increase property or sales tax rates. Again, these funds go to the owner of the property, the City of Frisco, not the Cowboys.

The funds come from the Tax Increment Reinvestment Zone (TIRZ), established in the late 1990s. It is comprised of 713 acres in the Stonebriar Mall area. There is approximately $1.1 billion in value at this time, which yields $16 million a year in tax revenue to FISD. The tax revenue generated through the taxable value in that area goes into a special fund that allows the District to participate in public-private partnerships that benefit the growth and development in the area and also allows FISD to balance its debt service rate by reimbursing its debt payment with these funds. By law, these funds cannot be used for the maintenance and operations of the school district, such as teacher salaries."
So let me understand all of this thread:

The TIRZ takes tax money from the Stonebriar area, some of which the citizens of Frisco pay when they purchase goods, and sends it to FISD so they can invest 30 million into an enclosed stadium. If the TIRZ did not exist would there be more money in the citizen's pockets, that would help to pay taxes for increased valuations, etc.?

So FISD, which has a minimum of 8-10 High Schools and more on the drawing boards as the population surges from 150,000+ to 350,000 needs a HUGE enclosed stadium. No one seems to have answered why the need for such a large stadium...what types of events would be held there...surely not FISD High School Football games.

Have you been in the newer High Schools? Stop in sometime and ask yourselves why they need to have the huge atrium entrances, the very fancy exteriors, the huge sports complexes, etc. It is eye opening if you have never been there. Ask yourself what did they cost and what is the operating costs for air/heat/electricity for the "extras".
Oh, I don't buy the argument and/or need to coddle the kids.

Comparison to Allen, McKinney appears to be bogus, self-serving comparisons in these threads.

Now the City of Frisco chips in and now owns facilities near/adjacent/attached to the Jerry Jones Memorial Complex.
Why does the City of Frisco have to own non-governmental facilities?

Does anyone in the City/FISD ever say NO!?
 

Piiilot

Platinum Member
So let me understand all of this thread:

The TIRZ takes tax money from the Stonebriar area, some of which the citizens of Frisco pay when they purchase goods, and sends it to FISD so they can invest 30 million into an enclosed stadium. If the TIRZ did not exist would there be more money in the citizen's pockets, that would help to pay taxes for increased valuations, etc.?

So FISD, which has a minimum of 8-10 High Schools and more on the drawing boards as the population surges from 150,000+ to 350,000 needs a HUGE enclosed stadium. No one seems to have answered why the need for such a large stadium...what types of events would be held there...surely not FISD High School Football games.

Have you been in the newer High Schools? Stop in sometime and ask yourselves why they need to have the huge atrium entrances, the very fancy exteriors, the huge sports complexes, etc. It is eye opening if you have never been there. Ask yourself what did they cost and what is the operating costs for air/heat/electricity for the "extras".
Oh, I don't buy the argument and/or need to coddle the kids.

Comparison to Allen, McKinney appears to be bogus, self-serving comparisons in these threads.

Now the City of Frisco chips in and now owns facilities near/adjacent/attached to the Jerry Jones Memorial Complex.
Why does the City of Frisco have to own non-governmental facilities?

Does anyone in the City/FISD ever say NO!?
Stop - all good questions, and you have to excuse my friend Eagle, he would defend the city if they decided boiling cats in the town square was a good idea. The time to ask WHY has passed. You should have asked why when they announced the plans to stick with the small school format, the time to ask why is when you attended a forum of candidates for open School Board Seats, the time to ask why was when you attended School Board Meetings - all of that is too late.

We are on the hook for what the elected officials have decided to do. We elected them, we bought into the plan. I used to work with a guy who had a great saying - "you cannot unf**k this monkey." The money for the Cowboys was stupid, I agree, too late, it's spent. This tax hike goes for money to operate our schools. Plain and simple. The schools have to operate, degrade our school district, you degrade your property values, degrade the school district, cram school rooms full of kids, degrade the quality of education the kids get, make life harder for the educators, they are going to leave and go to greener pastures.
 
So let me understand all of this thread: QUOTE]

The TIRZ takes tax money from the Stonebriar area, some of which the citizens of Frisco pay when they purchase goods, and sends it to FISD so they can invest 30 million into an enclosed stadium. If the TIRZ did not exist would there be more money in the citizen's pockets, that would help to pay taxes for increased valuations, etc.?

WRONG.. if the TIRZ didn't exist,Stonebriar area would not exist, the RoughRiders would not exits, and we would still have hot tub places on preston. Frisco city taxes would be OFF the chart. The TIRZ has generated huge benefit for the area.


So FISD, which has a minimum of 8-10 High Schools and more on the drawing boards as the population surges from 150,000+ to 350,000 needs a HUGE enclosed stadium. No one seems to have answered why the need for such a large stadium...what types of events would be held there...surely not FISD High School Football games.

Wrong. a third stadium site was on the drawing board.

Have you been in the newer High Schools? Stop in sometime and ask yourselves why they need to have the huge atrium entrances, the very fancy exteriors, the huge sports complexes, etc. It is eye opening if you have never been there. Ask yourself what did they cost and what is the operating costs for air/heat/electricity for the "extras".
Oh, I don't buy the argument and/or need to coddle the kids.

Wrong, the FISD buildings are extremely energy efficient and have huge Green components. Such as advanced AC units, and Advanced lighting systems that determines the amount of light in a room before coming on.




Comparison to Allen, McKinney appears to be bogus, self-serving comparisons in these threads.

Now the City of Frisco chips in and now owns facilities near/adjacent/attached to the Jerry Jones Memorial Complex.
Why does the City of Frisco have to own non-governmental facilities?

Does anyone in the City/FISD ever say NO!

YES.. Ask Nebraska furniture mart. The STAR is already a 1.5B project, soon to be at 2. Most of the investment was infrastructure, such as roads, parking garage.
The Event Center is already drawing major events, which generates huge economic benefit. Watch the NFL draft in the STAR.

IF you don't believe this publicity is powerful, just watch Donald Trump and what he has done with Free publicity.
 

pearceg

Diamond Member
Love this post. just that its' wrong at every fracking turn.

1. Look at McKinney. $50M+ for a stadium.
And once again, just because other cities build overwrought temples for their Friday Night Gridiron Warriors is no reason Phrisceaux needs to do the same, except for the satisfaction that jock-sniffing City and ISD leaders get from ****-waving in front of other cities.... and you just can't put a price on the importance of that.



2. Memorial.
If you include the major changes that are made every 5-7 years, including new turf, compliance with new laws, AKA ADA, (pretty soon, transgender bathrooms), etc, the cost for Memorial averages about $600k a year, and will be at 750-800k in 2025+
The more I think about this fetish for getting out from under maintenance costs, the more I'm convinced this is nothing but a pure misdirection smokescreen. Even if this $600k figure is accurate, it makes no sense to spend upfront 50 years worth of maintenance costs in present dollars just to get out from under present and future maintenance costs. Build a $15-20M stadium, pay $600k in maintenance costs a year for 30 years, and for only a few million dollars more, FISD owns the stadium, has complete control over scheduling, AND gets to control/take ownership of all the revenue streams instead of handing that money over to the tenant. But that doesn't come with photo ops for the Superintendent with Jerry Jones and the cheerleaders, so I can see why that's a less popular option. Plus, let's not fool ourselves into thinking FISD's $30M "partnership" with Jones is the last time they're going to be asked to dig into our wallets. The 11-year-old soccer stadium is getting a $40M facelift paid for by you and me instead of the billionaire Hunt family, and I'm certain the same will be true of our "partnership" with Jones.



4. Read the public information and not just a PAC's flier..
I have not been on any PAC's website nor have I read any fliers. But I have read up on sports economics from several sources for the last couple of decades and, while I'm no expert, I'm fairly certain I have a better grasp on the subject than the average legacy-building politician/civic leader.
 
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