FISD choosing sides in the city and school board election

TPW

Diamond Member
Below is the quote that I believe invalidates it as a credible source.

"These are some of the findings of a Harris Poll of 2,565 adults surveyed online between October 9 and 15, 2007 by Harris Interactive®. This survey was conceived and developed by Harris Interactive and was not commissioned by any organization. However, we sought and received valuable input from the National Association for Music Education on this subject."
So basically you are saying if God is asked what color the sky is and he says I made the sky blue you would say that his answer is obviously invalid because he had prior involvement. I get it....you have a formed opinion that can't be swayed regardless of the argument or evidence shown.
 

bizguy

Diamond Member
So basically you are saying if God is asked what color the sky is and he says I made the sky blue you would say that his answer is obviously invalid because he had prior involvement. I get it....you have a formed opinion that can't be swayed regardless of the argument or evidence shown.
Funny how you pick that part out... My problem with studies sponsored by entities such as the National Music Educators Association and the like is that the tend to not be well designed and almost always come to the conclusion that the sponsoring organization wishes to prove. Just like I wouldn't trust a study that concludes that more PC's are needed in the classroom if it was sponsored by Dell or IBM or someother group of PC manufacturers.

To the main point, a self selected poll on the internet is not scientific in the least - no matter who sponsored it. If you think that consitutes proof of your position, then it is as weak as I believe it to be. Below is a link to a real study concering school sponsored athletics and education. While it is biased towards athletic involvement through the schools, it does run through the research and points out the strong and weak points of each study and does conclude that there is not enough evidence to draw a direct cause and effect relationship between participation in school sports and increased academic performance.

http://www.la84foundation.org/3ce/HighSchoolSportsParticipation.pdf

I am still looking for a scientific study that says involvement in fine arts through the school district causes (not is correlated to) increased academic performance. To this point I have not seen one. As I said, I am willing to be convinced, but there has to be solid evidence from well designed studies.
 

mommy22

Bronze Member
Barring clear scientific evidence to the contrary

I say SUPPORT THE ARTS...support diversity of thought...support Renaissance thinking... and stop nickle and dime-ing our kids! A large part of the appeal of Frisco is the investment in children and education- if you are too cheap to agree, please feel free to MOVE ON OUT ..
 

mommyx2

Diamond Member
I say SUPPORT THE ARTS...support diversity of thought...support Renaissance thinking... and stop nickle and dime-ing our kids! A large part of the appeal of Frisco is the investment in children and education- if you are too cheap to agree, please feel free to MOVE ON OUT ..

Having millions in an art center is not investing in our children - it is investing in a building. If it is truly the arts you are wanting to support then put it into the school system and get the programs in place to teach the children the music, theater, art etc. There are fabulous programs in FISD (my son has been part of one of the top ones the past 3 years) and not having a huge performance center certainly has not stopped them. There are other places that they can perform (Eishman, Murchinson etc.)

If you need the huge building to feel you have a great arts program, then there are many choices already available.. but for us we will stay in FISD (with out the Arts Center) and support the programs that are already in place teaching our kids!
 

mommy22

Bronze Member
I was off-topic...on chipping away at the programs offered by FISD ... this was to the folks saying Reading, writing and arithmetic is all that is needed... sorry!
 

bizguy

Diamond Member
I say SUPPORT THE ARTS...support diversity of thought...support Renaissance thinking... and stop nickle and dime-ing our kids! A large part of the appeal of Frisco is the investment in children and education- if you are too cheap to agree, please feel free to MOVE ON OUT ..
Ruled by emotion much? Once again you cannot provide a study that proves the your side's assertion that arts and athletics paid for by the public school and using school time increases academic achievement. So, without any evidence you want to continue funding it? You have a right to your opinion. I say we should give the kids cooking less during third period... there's no evidence that it doesn't help test scores.

This has nothing to do with how much is paid in taxes, but has to do with what the core function and focus of the school district.

BTW, the Renaissance was financed by private benefactors, not the public education system....
 
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mommy22

Bronze Member
Congrats!

they say it takes one to know one... sticks and stones deary do not affect me.. would love to have you post something of value rather than just making fun of others' posts/opinions.
 

mommy22

Bronze Member
Ok, to clarify

I will beg indulgence as I attended private schools only... so, the way I see it BL (and a few other proponents of cutting the budget) you feel that 1) administration is bloated (no plan to efficiently manage a change at any level or timeline or projected savings with cost savings and value propositions), and are you willing to strike first (as an example of course!) at the schools where your precious cherubs attend?? 2) that subjects or enhancements to curriculum such as GT, AP, science, field trips, computers, music, art, PE, sports, ART (no discussion needed on the arts facility here) , special -education( special needs) or anything other than reading, math and writing composition are a waste of money and should be trimmed (again, what is your plan, your cost-benefit analysis ) and food service, landscaping, buses, campus counselors, campus nurses can be taken private?? (and how, based on volunteering funds? PTA funds? what?)

I see nothing but rhetoric that says simply 'do XX' but not how, why it is beneficial (except to save you a few dollars on your tax bill) ... so I may not be reading where you provide all this GREAT input and focus only where you complain... if so, my sincerest apologies are extended. :)
 

bizguy

Diamond Member
I will beg indulgence as I attended private schools only... so, the way I see it BL (and a few other proponents of cutting the budget) you feel that 1) administration is bloated (no plan to efficiently manage a change at any level or timeline or projected savings with cost savings and value propositions), and are you willing to strike first (as an example of course!) at the schools where your precious cherubs attend?? 2) that subjects or enhancements to curriculum such as GT, AP, science, field trips, computers, music, art, PE, sports, ART (no discussion needed on the arts facility here) , special -education( special needs) or anything other than reading, math and writing composition are a waste of money and should be trimmed (again, what is your plan, your cost-benefit analysis ) and food service, landscaping, buses, campus counselors, campus nurses can be taken private?? (and how, based on volunteering funds? PTA funds? what?)

I see nothing but rhetoric that says simply 'do XX' but not how, why it is beneficial (except to save you a few dollars on your tax bill) ... so I may not be reading where you provide all this GREAT input and focus only where you complain... if so, my sincerest apologies are extended. :)
You are certainly good at posing questions...

I agree with EBL. Where is the org chart so I recommend changes?

I think we have a difference in what constitutes an enhancement - AP, science, field trips (some, not all), and computers are not "enhancements" - the fulfill the core mission of the school - academics. GT can be argued either way - if the district did a better job working with kids whose intellectual age is beyond their school age, then the program - especially at the elementary level - would be redundant and should be scrapped as well (this from a parent of GT kid).

Athletics, arts, and music are not part of the core mission of educating young people and are in my mind "enhancements" and should be strictly extracurricular and funded outside of taxpayer money... (that's just my opinion, btw, and not shared by many)
 

mommy22

Bronze Member
you're right- I don't agree..

You are certainly good at posing questions...

I agree with EBL. Where is the org chart so I recommend changes?
So I will propose the same as for EBL... run for the Board so you can make your cuts proposal to someone who can do something with it... or get a job (do you want less than $60k/yr or 5% less than your counterparts in Allen/ Plano btw?) in the district. Or at least request the org chart from the ISD... I am not interested in spoon feeding you but am interested in seeing logical, well-thought ideas to accomplish the sweeping statements made...
 

bizguy

Diamond Member
So I will propose the same as for EBL... run for the Board so you can make your cuts proposal to someone who can do something with it... or get a job (do you want less than $60k/yr or 5% less than your counterparts in Allen/ Plano btw?) in the district. Or at least request the org chart from the ISD... I am not interested in spoon feeding you but am interested in seeing logical, well-thought ideas to accomplish the sweeping statements made...
Which have been presented -- but you just sweep them away in an emotional snit... If you are interested in rational debate then say so, but don't dismiss the discussion just because the level of detail you want is not available

Now I will say "Good Day Ma'am"...
 

mommy22

Bronze Member
wow... this passes for your argument I see

EBL- so far today you have called me : "hypocrite", "narrow-minded" and accused me of having a "double standard" -- adding stupid? Confused? Contrarian? Uninformed? Or just a another retread licking old wounds? And then to cap it off you resort to: No offense, but I think your parents should demand a refund on that private school tuition. Really?? NO OFFENSE?? hahaha

nice, nice, nice...